Brazilian V8 Hemi Video!

Discussion about the Hemi in general.

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Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Brazilian V8 Hemi Video!

Postby Emi-Sul » Mon May 09, 2005 11:37 pm

Hey folks,

I just got one of these, I just wondered if you Chrysler boys knew about your South American "brother" I got lots of info on this little mill if ya'll are intrested..

--EDITED 5/27/05--
NEW LINK....goes to video of engine on "sim test machine" at Portland Engine Rebuilders....thats me running the Machine.

http://home.comcast.net/~fairlane2k/Emi ... m-Test.wmv

James
Last edited by Emi-Sul on Sun May 29, 2005 9:41 am, edited 4 times in total.

freebird12345687
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:22 am

Postby freebird12345687 » Mon May 09, 2005 11:42 pm

what is it i'm very curious

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Mon May 09, 2005 11:50 pm

Its a Simca engine called th Emi-Sul only produced in Brazil 1966-1969.
Its a 147 cubes 140 horsepower 151 torque A TRUE HEMI chamber...
pretty cool little mill. only available with a 2bbl. carb tho..

2SLO4U
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Location: Gainesville, FL
Contact:

Postby 2SLO4U » Tue May 10, 2005 7:08 am

what sort of cars did they come in?
2003 1500 HEMI 2WD Laramie
1964 D100 426W High Performance Package

sofaking
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Location: minnesota

Postby sofaking » Tue May 10, 2005 8:45 pm


Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Tue May 10, 2005 10:45 pm

That is a piss-poor job of translating..! I am spoiled that my wife is a Brazilian and reads it all to me.

The engines came in Brazilian built Simca's from 1966-1969.
In the early 60's Chrysler bought the Rootes Group(sunbeam,talbot,simca,etc) and by 1968 all the Simcas made in Brazil were rebadged as Chryslers.

Here comes the part where you ban me from the board:
Simca cars used ford flathead V8/60's,and the Emi-Sul is pretty much a "copy" of the "ultra-rare" ARDUN conversion for the V8-60.

So what you got is a Chrysler built HEMI based on a Ford engine design!
http://home.comcast.net/~fairlane2k/Emi-Sul/OHV1.JPG

freebird12345687
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:22 am

Postby freebird12345687 » Wed May 11, 2005 12:39 am

pretty cool concept.........where can i get one?

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Wed May 11, 2005 1:00 am

you can learn portugese and go junk-yarding in Brazil. LOL
I actually am importing/selling them..etc.

freebird12345687
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:22 am

Postby freebird12345687 » Wed May 11, 2005 10:27 am

tried to learn spanish once. i'm too stupid to learn another language. anyway what transmissions are they compatable with? are there and US cars we could bolt them into? if you import you should definately advertise on here.

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Wed May 11, 2005 7:02 pm

I am not sure exactly what transmissions fit the block or the bell housing, I will be researching that in the next couple days....the only car I KNOW it will "bolt into" is a Simca Vedette (some were imported from France to USA),...of-course a little torch and weld you can make anything fit!....

freebird12345687
Posts: 34
Joined: Fri Mar 18, 2005 12:22 am

Postby freebird12345687 » Wed May 11, 2005 10:07 pm

please share, man i'm really interested in the little piece. If it weren't for guys like yourself i'd never learn neat things like this.

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Wed May 11, 2005 10:49 pm

I am happy to share
I found this thing on accident.... lots of help from my wife and the in-laws and pretty soon I had a source for parts and info... these engines and parts are getting hard to find...most have long since been recycled..

I have a complete parts catalog,owners manual. motors manual (bad photo copy) all for the engine.

the parts catalog shows chrysler built ford flathead V8's in Brazil http://home.comcast.net/~fairlane2k/Emi ... _V8-60.jpg

So most everything on this motor is ford type..

Alot of the old midget racers really dig this thing...wishin' they had this 40yrs ago... they love it cause its like the Ardun kit for the V/8-60 (only 30pr made!)
http://home.comcast.net/~fairlane2k/Emi ... _heads.JPG

I bet the trans is some sort of ford type tranny...

mart
Posts: 536
Joined: Tue Mar 22, 2005 2:06 pm

Brazilian Ford Hemi

Postby mart » Tue May 24, 2005 7:21 am

I believe the heads used on these engines were more or less direct copies of the Ardun V860 heads developed by Zora Arkus Duntov, of Corvette fame, before he went to work for GM. The Ardun heads were made in very limited numbers in the late 1940's and early 1950's in two versions - one for the standard size Ford and Merc flatheads and the other for the little V860. The V860 powered cars never sold well in North America - (although the engines were coveted by midget racers) and only made from 1937 through '41 (and maybe a very few in '42). but the engine was used extensively in both pre and postwar European and South American markets. Roots-Sunbeam-Simca continued the V8 60 in Europe and South America in the original flathead configuration long right into the early 1960's. By the early '60's the engine was highly obsolete, compared to the OHV engines on the market in Brazil and elsewhere. Rather than dump all their tooling and develop or adapt another engine, Roots-Sunbeam-Simca decided to upgrade the engine for the Brazilian market. Someone brilliantly came up with the idea of copying the Ardun hemi heads. In one quick and economical move, did they now have an OHV engine without tooling up a whole new engine...they had a hemi to boot!
The updated V860 with the copied Ardun hemi heads was an incredible little engine and was produced right into the mid to late 1970's! By the way, the engine was continued in production long after Chrysler bought Roots-Sunbeam-Simca from Ford - thus technically at least, this engine *became* a "Chrysler hemi" - albeit a "baby hemi" and based on a Ford V860 Flathead!

Just a thought here. In the early '60's Simca in France produced a version of the V860 with the normal "valves in the block" flathead configuration, but used an aluminum block to save weight. If someone could source one of those French Simca aluminum blocks and combine it with the aluminum Brazilian "Ardun" heads!!! Wow! That would be one trick piece for lightweight T bucket or track style roadster!!! :)

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Tue May 24, 2005 9:21 pm

"I believe the heads used on these engines were more or less direct copies of the Ardun V860 heads developed by Zora Arkus Duntov"

Actaully they are a very much improved version....
the ARDUN heads for the V8/60 had a very complicated valvetrain (used 3 pushrods per cylinder. 2 on the exhaust side and a series of bell cranks..)and didnt perform well at high RPMS. the Brazilian engine uses a conventional 1 pushrod per valve. not to mention the Brazilian engine has superior machine work,better valves/ports/chamber size...not to mention a V8/60 ARDUN is 105hp and a Brazilian OHV is 140hp (w/a single 2v carb)


"The V860 powered cars never sold well in North America - (although the engines were coveted by midget racers) and only made from 1937 through '41 (and maybe a very few in '42)"

incorrect... US V8/60's were 1937-1940 ONLY.

"The updated V860 with the copied Ardun hemi heads was an incredible little engine and was produced right into the mid to late 1970's! "

Also incorrect...this OHV engine was built 1966-1969 ONLY in 1970 Chrysler of Brazil started production of the Dodge Dart.

Emi-Sul
Posts: 8
Joined: Sun May 08, 2005 10:15 pm

Postby Emi-Sul » Sat May 28, 2005 11:15 am

I "SIM-TESTED" the Emi-Sul on thursday nite after work. The link is to some video of the test
http://home.comcast.net/~fairlane2k/Emi ... m-Test.avi

The engine turns over real nice. I did a bearing check earlier in the week,every thing looked to be in good shape...especially for a 35yrs old engine.
compression test showed all cylinders 120# compression (two cylinders actually had 130#) my test may be invalid though...I stupidly forgot to remover the engine lift plate from the intake manifold,thus choking the engine. I believe if I were to remove the plate and re-test the engine the results would be better. Oil flow was nice...all the valvetrain oiled well and functioned .

James

Simca do Brasil
Posts: 1
Joined: Thu Jun 16, 2005 8:24 am

Postby Simca do Brasil » Thu Jun 16, 2005 8:40 am

There was a guy called Jack Pasteur. He was a french man, he comes from France to Brazil near to 1960 to organize the brazilian unit of Simca.

He was the man who get the ardun´s to the ancient engine, it happened before Chrysler. So, there was Simca with Hemi in 1966, its name were "Simca Chambord Emi-Sul", "Simca Rallye Emi-Sul" and "Simca Présidence Emi-Sul".

In 1967, the Simca made a "upgrade" and the cars changed a lot. They were "Simca Esplanada" e "Simca Regente". There was "Simca Jangada "Emi-sul" too.

There was a Chrysler in ´68 and ´69 called "GTX", with hemi.

Dodge Dart appear in ´69.

Sorry, but my english is too bad.

pilou
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am
Location: france

Postby pilou » Tue Aug 30, 2005 6:53 am

The ardun cylinderhead was designed at the begin for the manufacturer Allard to fit on his cars equiped with V8/60
A french engine preparator,Ferry,bought all the stock of ardun heads but never use it
When Simca france decide to stop production of this car "vedette "(beaulieu,chambord,...fitted with Aquilon V8:a v8/60 newest version),he give the production line to simca do brazil who decide to produce sport version of these vedette and bought the ardun head to Ferry

pilou
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am
Location: france

Postby pilou » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:02 am

http://jusspress.com/day.php?userid=206 ... ime=142144

Clip of an Aquilon,the V8.60 modified for simca "vedette" 84 horsepower

Image

My simca vedette versailles 1956

pilou
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am
Location: france

Re: Brazilian Ford Hemi

Postby pilou » Tue Aug 30, 2005 7:32 am

mart wrote:I believe the heads used on these engines were more or less direct copies of the Ardun V860 heads developed by Zora Arkus Duntov, of Corvette fame, before he went to work for GM. The Ardun heads were made in very limited numbers in the late 1940's and early 1950's in two versions - one for the standard size Ford and Merc flatheads and the other for the little V860. The V860 powered cars never sold well in North America - (although the engines were coveted by midget racers) and only made from 1937 through '41 (and maybe a very few in '42). but the engine was used extensively in both pre and postwar European and South American markets. Roots-Sunbeam-Simca continued the V8 60 in Europe and South America in the original flathead configuration long right into the early 1960's. By the early '60's the engine was highly obsolete, compared to the OHV engines on the market in Brazil and elsewhere. Rather than dump all their tooling and develop or adapt another engine, Roots-Sunbeam-Simca decided to upgrade the engine for the Brazilian market. Someone brilliantly came up with the idea of copying the Ardun hemi heads. In one quick and economical move, did they now have an OHV engine without tooling up a whole new engine...they had a hemi to boot!
The updated V860 with the copied Ardun hemi heads was an incredible little engine and was produced right into the mid to late 1970's! By the way, the engine was continued in production long after Chrysler bought Roots-Sunbeam-Simca from Ford - thus technically at least, this engine *became* a "Chrysler hemi" - albeit a "baby hemi" and based on a Ford V860 Flathead!

Just a thought here. In the early '60's Simca in France produced a version of the V860 with the normal "valves in the block" flathead configuration, but used an aluminum block to save weight. If someone could source one of those French Simca aluminum blocks and combine it with the aluminum Brazilian "Ardun" heads!!! Wow! That would be one trick piece for lightweight T bucket or track style roadster!!! :)


Simca france never use aluminium block for his engine,only the cylinder heads were in aluminium

pilou
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am
Location: france

Postby pilou » Tue Aug 30, 2005 9:30 am

up!

pilou
Posts: 5
Joined: Fri Aug 26, 2005 9:44 am
Location: france

Postby pilou » Wed Aug 31, 2005 1:36 am

A Question: do you know if in USA,there is always 2 carb pipe to sell for v8/60?

hardhatz
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Location: Riverside California
Contact:

Re: Brazilian Ford Hemi

Postby hardhatz » Fri Feb 15, 2008 11:16 pm

Simca france never use aluminium block for his engine,only the cylinder heads were in aluminium[/quote]


Somebody did, cos I had one. Sure wish I still did...
It was all-aluminum, flathead.

beaulieu
Posts: 1
Joined: Wed Jun 09, 2010 5:26 pm

Re: Brazilian V8 Hemi Video!

Postby beaulieu » Tue Oct 09, 2012 6:40 pm

Emi-Sul:

Please reply to beaulieu regarding your post of May 09, '05 as I would like to know if you still have the Emi-Sul engine and any contacts in Brazil.

Thank you


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